Oligarchie
From Kristos Vocabulary Booster
Czech
Noun
oligarchie, f
- government by only a few, often the wealthy
- those who make up an oligarchic government
Gary
> "Bob Felts"
> news:96CA7083-00F2-CEA8-8EEF-753A42BE06FA@srcbs.org...
> > Gary
> >
[...]
>
> >
> > > So I believe God.
> >
> > No, you believe your simplistic and contradictory view of what you think
> > Scripture says.
>
> Most Christians view the this point as I do. You are in the very small
> tiny minority. The "reformed" position is a minority position among even
> evangelical Christians, let alone all Christians.
So what? Truth has never been determined by numbers. If you want to
take refuge in the multitude, be my guest.
The Apostle Paul is far, far more radical than most Christians are
willing to admit.
>
> > > God also says He saves those who believe.
> >
> > Of course. But you then go on to add, contrary to everything Scipture
> > says, that belief is initiated by man.
>
> Amazing that you never post any Scripture to try to back up
> your position. But the reason is obvious, because there are
> none.
>
I posted them in the post to which you responded.
> > You conveniently ignore "and that not of yourselves", "not of blood or
> > of the will of the flesh or of the will of man, but of God", and "So it
> > depends not on human will or exertion."
>
> I don't ignore anything the Bible says. What does not depend upon human
> will or exertion is the new birth which, since God does it, cannot be done
> by man.
Do you think the new birth is somehow different from salvation? Because
if you admit that the new birth is salvation, then you've just agreed
with Bart, me, and Paul that salvation does not depend on the human
will.
>
> Even Calvin denied the "and that not of yourselves" did not refer to
> faith! And the experts in Greek support this position. Greek grammar you
> know.
>
I do know. "and that not of yourselves" refers to salvation. So the
question becomes, "is faith a part of the gift"? Since you just said
that the new birth does not depend on human will or effort, either
you're going to have to deny that the new birth is equivalent to being
saved, or you're going to have to realize that faith is a part of the
gift, too.
> > > God is pleased to save those who believe. 1 Corinthians 1:21 For after
> > > that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased
> > > God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
> > >
> > > Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is
> > > the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the
> > > Jew first, and also to the Greek.
> > >
> > > Thank God we can believe Him and not you guys!
> >
> > Where do either of these verses say where the source of belief is? You
> > make man the source, when Scripture says that God is the source.
>
> God explains how faith comes. One comes to Christ by faith.
> Hence if one has faith one comes to Christ.
>
You evaded the question. Where does faith come from?
>
> John 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be
> all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and
> hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
>
> Though God teaches every man, many men refuse to listen and
> learn.
>
Sure. But is this because God hardens them or because some of them have
a quality that the others don't have and, through their own effort,
listen and learn?
> 2 Corinthians 6:1 We then, as workers together with him,
> beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in
> vain.
>
> One CAN receive the Grace of God in VAIN.
Because God makes it so.
>
> Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath
> appeared to all men,
>
And? What are you trying to make this passage say?
> > > No one would be saved listening to guys like you.
> >
> > Why? Is God not able to save?
>
> Because
>
> Matthew 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees,
> hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against
> men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them
> that are entering to go in.
>
So what? Do you think that the scribes and Pharisees are stronger than
God? That what man has shut God cannot open?
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