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"Bob Felts" wrote in message
news:96CA7083-00F2-CEA8-8EEF-753A42BE06FA@srcbs.org...
> Gary wrote:
>
> > "Bob Felts" wrote in message
> > news:7449D804-014F-526C-3DC3-6817D93729E2@srcbs.org...
> > > Matthew Johnson wrote:
> > >
> > > Sure I did. If your salvation is contingent on you
having belief then
> > > it is a positive quality (otherwise, why would God
save you?) and is a
> > > sure sign of salvation by works.
> >
> > No it is not. God says that faith is not works.
>
> The way God views faith it isn't a work. The way you view
faith it is.

I truly believe that the way you view faith is it a work,
but the way the Bible and I view faith it cannot possibly
be a work. It is the very opposite of any kind of work.

>
> > So I believe God.
>
> No, you believe your simplistic and contradictory view of
what you think
> Scripture says.

Most Christians view the this point as I do. You are in the
very small tiny minority. The "reformed" position is a
minority
position among even evangelical Christians, let alone all
Christians.

> > God also says He saves those who believe.
>
> Of course. But you then go on to add, contrary to
everything Scipture
> says, that belief is initiated by man.

Amazing that you never post any Scripture to try to back up
your position. But the reason is obvious, because there are
none.

> You conveniently ignore "and that not of yourselves", "not
of blood or
> of the will of the flesh or of the will of man, but of
God", and "So it
> depends not on human will or exertion."

I don't ignore anything the Bible says. What does not depend
upon
human will or exertion is the new birth which, since God
does it,
cannot be done by man.

Even Calvin denied the "and that not of yourselves" did not
refer
to faith! And the experts in Greek support this position.
Greek
grammar you know.

> > God is pleased to save those who believe.
> > 1 Corinthians 1:21 For after that in the wisdom of God
the
> > world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the
> > foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
> >
> > Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of
Christ:
> > for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one
that
> > believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
> >
> > Thank God we can believe Him and not you guys!
>
> Where do either of these verses say where the source of
belief is? You
> make man the source, when Scripture says that God is the
source.

God explains how faith comes. One comes to Christ by faith.
Hence if one has faith one comes to Christ.


John 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be
all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and
hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

Though God teaches every man, many men refuse to listen and
learn.

2 Corinthians 6:1 We then, as workers together with him,
beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in
vain.

One CAN receive the Grace of God in VAIN.

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath
appeared to all men,

> > No one would be saved listening to guys like you.
>
> Why? Is God not able to save?

Because

Matthew 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees,
hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against
men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them
that are entering to go in.

Gary





















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